The Handmaid’s Tale Chapter 26: Why Didn’t Gilead Just Use IVF? | Banned Books Podcast

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Welcome to Bandcamp.

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I'm Jennifer And I'm Dan, and this is the podcast where we read banned books out loud, and then we try to figure out why they were banned in the first place.

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This season we're reading The Handmaid's Tale by Margaret Atwood, and you can consider this a quick spoiler warning because Jennifer's about to start reading from the book out loud word for word.

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So that means anything coming out of Jennifer's mouth is probably gonna be new to you unless you watched the TV show or read the book before.

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But if you're new here, you can jump in right here.

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We're gonna get you up to speed fast because we have a secret weapon.

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More on him in a second.

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If you are confused, there's a good chance we're gonna be confused too because we've never read the book either.

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It's what makes Band Camp different than other book podcasts.

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let's get to our secret weapon.

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Buddy boy, roll it on in here.

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Look at this guy, everybody.

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We have ourselves an actual fact-checking robot.

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he's gonna fill you in on where we left off last time in The Handmaid's Tale Previously on Band Camp, the commander slipped the handmaid an old banned Vogue women's magazine and got off on watching her want it.

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Then she asked him for hand lotion, and he had no idea their rooms get searched for exactly that kind of thing.

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Dan wanted to send the guy on Undercover Boss so he could learn what a handmaid's life is actually like.

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Not his worst idea.

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There's a particular kind of power that only works if nobody official ever finds out you have it.

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I've been trying to work out if that still counts as power at all.

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Take it away, Jennifer.

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Thank you, robot.

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And with that being said, scary book people, let's begin chapter 26 of Margaret Atwood's The Handmaid's Tale When the night for the ceremony came around again, two or three weeks later, I found that things were changed.

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There was an awkwardness now that there hadn't been before.

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Before, I treated it like a job, an unpleasant job to be gone through as fast as possible so it could be over with.

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Oh no, does she want it to last longer now or something? What, what the Now she's liking it.

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No, no, no, no, no, no, no, Steel yourself," my mother used to say before examinations I didn't wanna take or swims in cold water.

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I never thought much at the time about what the phrase meant, but it had something to do with metal or armor, and that's what I would do.

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I would steel myself.

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I would pretend not to be present, not in the flesh.

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This state of absence of existing apart from the body had been true of the commander too, I knew now.

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Probably he thought about other things the whole time he was with me, with us, for of course Serena Joy was there on those evenings also.

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might have been thinking about what he did during the day, or about playing golf, or about what he'd had for dinner.

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The sexual act, although he performed it in a perfunctory way, must have been largely unconscious for him, like scratching himself.

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Except he had an orgasm at the end.

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Yes He can't help that.

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That's just a consequence I know, but if you're gonna play golf and then you have an orgasm at the end, you're gonna think differently about going to golf, yeah, it makes sense I gotta meet Bill.

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We're playing golf today.

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And then I'm gonna have an orgasm Not with Bill though But that night, the first since the beginning of whatever this new arrangement was between us, I had no name for it.

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I felt shy of him.

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I felt, for one thing, that he was actually looking at me, and I didn't like it.

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The lights were on as usual, since Serena Joy always avoided anything that would have created an aura of romance or eroticism, however slight.

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Overhead lights, harsh despite the canopy.

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It was like being on an operating table in the full glare, like being on a stage.

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Why in the hell would you guys come up with this ridiculous plan in the first place? I am...

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My mind is I know, like I'm really curious how it, how it got to this point, you know? my whole idea of what this story was before we started reading it was this was a society where they forced these women to have sex with people they didn't wanna have sex with.

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Yeah.

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But that's not what's happening.

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sex is, again, like...

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Well, I mean, it, it is sex, mechanically sex, but when I think of sex, I think of some form of attraction, of lust, of, like, some kind of, you know, animal magnetism.

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Someone should be happy in this.

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I know we, we're always saying that.

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Nobody is happy with this situation.

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I thought this was gonna be an effed-up society where at least the guys were happy.

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I mean, it's not that he wasn't unhappy though, in the way that I assume the Handmaid is.

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Because I mean, for him it's just like, like she said, like scratching himself.

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Where he has an ejaculation at the end, yes but what is he, but he's not suffering at all, you know? Whereas I think the Handmaid is kind of suffering It was like being on an operating table in the full glare, like being on a stage.

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I was conscious that my legs were hairy In the straggly way of legs that have once been shaved but have grown back.

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I was conscious of my armpits too, although of course he couldn't see them.

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I felt uncouth.

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This act of copulation, fertilization perhaps, which should have been no more to me than a bee is to a flower, had become for me indecorous, an embarrassing breach of propriety that it hadn't been before.

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And that, see, that's where this seems particularly important to whatever society they built to make the handmaids seem subhuman or not human.

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Because in the '80s when Margaret Atwood wrote this, they had IVF, or not IVF.

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What's the thing? Like, where you can incubate an egg and grow a person, right? I think IVF is where they, they make it in a test tube, but then they implant the fertilized egg back into the woman And don't you think even that is not sexy? That is probably super uncomfortable? Yeah, I'm 'Cause it's not the person you love going up in there.

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It's like some clinical test tube, rubber gloved hand.

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Here you go Between the two of you, that's over 100 years of lived human experience, and neither of you can explain how a baby is made.

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You're both closer to the grave than to kindergarten.

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Please learn one fact about the world you've been living in this whole time We're trying One answer, two questions.

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IVF wasn't science fiction to Atwood.

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Elise Brown was born in seventy-eight, seven years before this book came out.

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Gilead skipped it anyway because scientists controlling reproduction instead of God doesn't sell well to theocrats, and because babies were never really the point.

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Control was.

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Can't build a hierarchy out of a petri dish.

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You need bodies to own outright.

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Growing one completely outside a woman, still can't.

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Best we've got is premature lambs surviving in a bag for a few weeks.

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The men who built Gilead weren't confused about the science.

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They just liked owning people more than solving problems.

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Hmm.

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I think it's important because it is very relevant to this chapter.

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Because now it's not just clinical, They're trying to make her a not person, but she's a person, and especially now that he's played Scrabble with her and whatever.

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Like she's a person to him now, and now it's getting kind of fuzzy and now he just empowered her by giving her some reminders, Mm-hmm right? Like, "Hey, I gave you that Vogue magazine the other day.

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I reintroduced you to playing Scrabble.

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You're an actual person, just remember that."

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He was no longer a thing to me.

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Point proven.

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She- Thank now he's also not just a thing.

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That was the problem.

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I realized it that night, and the realization has stayed with me.

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It complicates.

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no more so than when she was gripping my hand so hard that her rings bit my flesh, pulling my hands back as well, which she must have done on purpose to make me as uncomfortable as she could.

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The hatred was no longer pure and simple.

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Partly I was jealous of her, but how could I be jealous of a woman so obviously dried up and unhappy? she comes out hitting hard all the time.

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Margaret Atwood.

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every chance she has to remind us that Serena Joy is old and dried up down there, she goes for it the Handmaid confuses me sometimes.

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Like, why would she ever be jealous of such a evil person? Nevertheless, I was jealous, but I also felt guilty about her.

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I felt I was an intruder in a territory that ought to have been hers.

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Now that I was seeing the commander on the sly, if only to play his games and listen to him talk, our functions were no longer as separate as they should have been in theory I was taking something away from her, although she didn't know it.

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I was filching? Filching robot.

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Wait, I...

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Oh, Jennifer, filching is not good.

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I could be totally wrong, and this is just, I know s- things because of the Dan and Scott show that I shouldn't know.

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Oh, well, that's a word I'm not familiar with Oh, okay.

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Filching, stealing but petty stealing.

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The kind where you pocket something small when nobody's looking.

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A pickpocket filches a wallet.

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I'm thinking of another word that is far more graphically dirty and obscene.

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What am I thinking of and what is the definition? Oh, sweet baby Jesus, please don't tell me you're thinking of the word felching.

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I will not be fact-checking that for you, you pervert didn't this word come up when, uh, that story broke about RFK Jr.

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and that reporter Oh, thank, oh.

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Yes, same scandal.

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RFK Jr.

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allegedly cheating on his wife with a journalist named Olivia Nuzzi.

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Felching, for anyone blissfully unaware, is the act of slurping bodily fluid out of a certain anal cavity after a particular act of lovemaking.

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Classy.

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Her ex-fiancé, Ryan Liza, laid it all out in a court filing.

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Texts, poems, all of it, and felching became a bigger Google search than turkey recipes for an entire day.

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texts and poems.

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Oh, my dear lass, I'm going to stick my tongue in your ass.

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And Bobby feels very strongly about it, he's so into women's health.

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He-- And you know, he's really unbelievable.

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He- It's such a passion.

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But I said, "Bobby, I want you to do it, but leave the liquid gold to, to me.

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Oh my God, Donald.

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And I assume by liquid gold you're not talking about Olivia Nuzzi's poo.

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You're talking about oil, right? Oh my God, felching And that's gonna be my next Scrabble word.

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never mind that it was something she apparently didn't want or had no use for, had rejected even.

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Still, it was hers, and if I took it away, this mysterious it I couldn't quite define, for the commander wasn't in love with me.

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I refused to believe he felt anything for me as extreme as that.

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What would be left for her? Why should I care? I told myself.

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She's nothing to me.

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She dislikes me.

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She'd have me out of the house in a minute, or worse, if she could think up any excuse at all.

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If she were to find out, for instance, he wouldn't be able to intervene to save me.

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The transgressions of women in the household, whether Martha or Handmaid, are supposed to be under the jurisdiction of the wives alone.

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She was a malicious and vengeful woman.

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I knew that.

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Nevertheless, I couldn't shake it.

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that small compunction towards her.

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Little more empathetic than I would be.

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I'd probably try to make him fall in love with me.

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Because I'd hate her so much I know what they say, that, "Oh, no, the wives are in charge of the women, and the men aren't even supposed to look."

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Remember when they bumped into each other in the hallway and it was really awkward? Mm-hmm isn't that just a thing that the men can throw at the, at the wives to make them think like, "No, no, you have power.

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You, uh, um, you're, you're in charge of the women.

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off limits to me.

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I cannot deal...

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I mean, I'm gonna stick my penis in them.

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Other than that, totally hands off the women.

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That is up to you guys."

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Don't you think that's just no different than him humoring her when she's knitting her little scarves? Oh yeah, it might be.

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Yeah But then on the other hand, we do know the commander, and he does seem to not be happy.

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Like I said, I don't think anyone's happy.

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I don't know why they built this society This is like the, the running thing with us.

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Yeah Like, I understood the "1984" mentality.

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I understood "Fahrenheit 451."

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I understood why they would want to make that world.

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still a little, uh, iffy about the "Brave New World" concept as a, as a dystopian reality.

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That seemed a little weird too.

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Yeah but it made more sense than Margaret Atwood's world.

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Like, No one's wetting their beak, no one's happy.

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Yeah, see, I'm wondering who's benefiting from this.

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There's gotta be someone You have asked me some version of this question in nearly every chapter this season.

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Why build a miserable society? Who benefits? Same answer every time.

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Control, not cash.

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Jeez, oh, Pete, I would rather go back to talking about felching.

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That topic at least resolved.

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Read the next part before I lose the will to function.

167
00:14:39,635.03934152 --> 00:14:43,892.47734152
also, now I had power over her, of a kind, although she didn't know it.

168
00:14:44,892.47734152 --> 00:14:45,992.47734152
And I enjoyed that.

169
00:14:46,322.47734152 --> 00:14:49,51.78337512
Why pretend? I enjoyed it a lot.

170
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But the commander could give me away so easily by a look, by a gesture, by some tiny slip that would reveal to anyone watching that there was something between us now.

171
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He almost did it the night of the ceremony.

172
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He reached his hand up as if to touch my face.

173
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I moved my head to the side To warn him away, hoping Serena Joy hadn't noticed, and he withdrew his hand again, withdrew into himself and his single-minded journey.

174
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"Don't do that again," I said to him the next time we were alone.

175
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"Do what?" he said.

176
00:15:27,705.47100641 --> 00:15:31,115.47100641
"Try to touch me like that when we're-- when she's there."

177
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"Did I?" he said.

178
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You could get me transferred," I said, "to the colonies.

179
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You know that.

180
00:15:37,371.98023424 --> 00:15:38,217.10113677
Or worse."

181
00:15:39,217.10113677 --> 00:15:49,735.10213677
I thought he should continue to act in public as if I were a large vase or a window, part of the background, inanimate or transparent Yeah, just don't touch it.

182
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That's a good point for anyone in society.

183
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If you see a big, uh, expensive vase, look, don't touch But what's really interesting, is that her and the commander are equals She gets him alone and she says, don't do that again."

184
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It's like, "Well, who are you? You're the handmaid."

185
00:16:08,71.31872523 --> 00:16:10,51.31872523
"Yeah, don't effing touch me like that again.

186
00:16:10,51.31872523 --> 00:16:11,541.31872523
You're gonna get me kicked out of here."

187
00:16:11,581.31872523 --> 00:16:31,958.04516663
Like, that's a power play that the handmaid is telling him Yeah, she's pretty good at the power play, isn't she? Do you think, could you keep the secret? if my life depended on it, I would to everyone though? Like, I would wait until Rita or Cora or one of these old biddies, one of the Marthas gives, gives you just a little bit of crap.

188
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I'd be like, "Don't tell me what to do.

189
00:16:34,468.04516663 --> 00:16:38,268.04516663
I happen to play Scrabble with the son of a bitch every night."

190
00:16:41,73.6080604 --> 00:16:42,203.6080604
I'm sorry," he said.

191
00:16:42,293.6080604 --> 00:16:44,708.9702945
"I didn't mean to, but I find it..."

192
00:16:44,969.8367349 --> 00:16:46,869.8357349
What?" I said when he didn't go on.

193
00:16:47,279.8357349 --> 00:16:48,669.8357349
"Impersonal," he said.

194
00:16:49,239.8357349 --> 00:16:51,999.8367349
"How long did it take you to find that out?" I said.

195
00:16:52,279.8357349 --> 00:16:56,939.8367349
You can see from the way I was speaking to him that we were already on different terms.

196
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For the generations that come after, Aunt Lydia said, it will be so much better.

197
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The women will live in harmony together, all in one family.

198
00:17:14,198.5886764 --> 00:17:15,948.5896764
You will be like daughters to them.

199
00:17:16,188.5896764 --> 00:17:25,60.3297485
and when the population level is up to scratch again, we'll no longer have to transfer you from one house to another because there will be enough to go around.

200
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There can be bonds of real affection, she said, blinking at us ingratiatingly Women united for a common end, helping one another in their daily chores as they walk the path of life together, each performing her appointed task.

201
00:17:42,20.5204621 --> 00:17:50,835.65637
Why expect one woman to carry out all the functions necessary to the serene running of a household? it isn't reasonable or humane.

202
00:17:51,205.65637 --> 00:17:53,355.65937
Your daughters will have greater freedom.

203
00:17:53,715.65837 --> 00:17:58,355.65737
We are working toward the goal of a little garden for each one, each one of you.

204
00:17:58,655.65737 --> 00:18:05,934.023184
The clasped hands again, the breathy voice, and that's just for one instance, the raised finger wagging at us.

205
00:18:06,184.024184 --> 00:18:14,148.2027061
But we can't be greedy pigs and demand too much before it's ready, now can we? Donald, you, you, you like to call women pigs.

206
00:18:14,198.2027061 --> 00:18:16,48.2027061
You agree with Aunt Lydia.

207
00:18:16,273.9062589 --> 00:18:25,443.7740989
I love cows Good, good point The fact is that I'm his mistress.

208
00:18:26,788.1811625 --> 00:18:29,258.1811625
Men at the top always have mistresses.

209
00:18:29,608.1811625 --> 00:18:34,808.1811625
Why should things be any different now? The arrangements aren't quite the same, granted.

210
00:18:35,198.1811625 --> 00:18:41,788.1801625
The mistress used to be kept in a minor house or apartment of her own, and now they've amalgamated things.

211
00:18:42,33.322258 --> 00:18:44,973.322258
But underneath, it's the same, more or less.

212
00:18:45,313.321258 --> 00:18:48,276.4198241
Outside woman, they used to call it in some countries.

213
00:18:49,276.4198241 --> 00:18:50,946.4198241
I am the outside woman.

214
00:18:51,366.4208241 --> 00:18:54,762.4520233
It's my job to provide what is otherwise lacking.

215
00:18:55,762.4520233 --> 00:18:56,812.4500233
even the scrabble.

216
00:18:57,282.4520233 --> 00:19:00,985.2018794
It's an absurd as well as Ignominious position.

217
00:19:01,985.2018794 --> 00:19:04,85.2018794
Sometimes I think she knows.

218
00:19:04,525.2018794 --> 00:19:07,125.2018794
Sometimes I think they're in collusion.

219
00:19:08,138.7744448 --> 00:19:15,814.3769366
Sometimes I think she put him up to it and is laughing at me, as I laugh from time to time and with irony at myself.

220
00:19:16,814.3769366 --> 00:19:19,174.3769366
Let her take the weight she can say to herself.

221
00:19:19,594.3769366 --> 00:19:22,494.3769366
Maybe she's withdrawn from him almost completely.

222
00:19:22,944.3779366 --> 00:19:30,849.9630923
Maybe that's her version of freedom But even so, and stupidly enough, I'm happier than I was before.

223
00:19:31,319.9630923 --> 00:19:38,269.2820809
It's something to do for one thing, something to fill the time at night instead of sitting alone in my room.

224
00:19:39,72.6384045 --> 00:19:40,672.6384045
It's something else to think about.

225
00:19:40,984.443096 --> 00:19:45,246.2477876
I don't love the commander or anything like it, but he's of interest to me.

226
00:19:45,418.0524791 --> 00:19:46,908.0524791
He occupies space.

227
00:19:47,168.0524791 --> 00:19:48,758.0524791
He is more than a shadow.

228
00:19:49,54.3122532 --> 00:19:50,14.3122532
And I for him.

229
00:19:50,394.3122532 --> 00:19:53,574.3122532
To him, I'm no longer merely a usable body.

230
00:19:54,24.3122532 --> 00:20:02,749.5551566
To him, I'm not just a boat with no cargo, a chalice with no wine in it, an oven, to be crude, minus the bun.

231
00:20:03,349.5551566 --> 00:20:06,39.5541566
To him, I am not merely empty.

232
00:20:07,149.6849994 --> 00:20:08,363.1639325
End of chapter.

233
00:20:13,135.1972132 --> 00:20:14,65.1972132
All right, don't go anywhere.

234
00:20:14,65.1972132 --> 00:20:15,585.1972132
We've got plenty of show left.

235
00:20:15,585.1972132 --> 00:20:19,300.0590439
We're gonna get into PPP in a second, and Beowulf is coming up.

236
00:20:19,320.0590439 --> 00:20:26,251.9322132
we We're really bad at the business of podcasting, Jennifer.

237
00:20:26,465.9322132 --> 00:20:27,15.9322132
I know.

238
00:20:27,282.9640283 --> 00:20:30,192.9640283
Here is something that will truly help our show grow.

239
00:20:30,442.9640283 --> 00:20:35,340.6547995
If you haven't followed us yet on Apple or Spotify, please do so.

240
00:20:35,390.6547995 --> 00:20:36,580.6547995
Just do it this week.

241
00:20:36,610.6557995 --> 00:20:38,290.6557995
It really truly helps us.

242
00:20:38,300.6547995 --> 00:20:43,40.6547995
It, it's, it has to do with the algorithms and all that kind of dumb, stupid computer stuff.

243
00:20:43,380.610693 --> 00:20:48,743.5155551
but following us and listening to us i- is like, y- we cannot tell you how important it is.

244
00:20:48,743.5165551 --> 00:20:55,527.4431664
So if you've ever gotten any value from this show, if we helped you, if we've made you laugh, if we made you think, please do it this week.

245
00:20:55,577.4441664 --> 00:21:00,477.4431664
Just go to Spotify or Apple or both and just find Bandcamp and follow it.

246
00:21:00,857.4431664 --> 00:21:01,307.4431664
Thank you.

247
00:21:01,637.4461664 --> 00:21:08,577.4441664
The other thing we never ask though about is we never ask for people to leave reviews, but we definitely appreciate when we get reviews.

248
00:21:08,597.4451664 --> 00:21:16,267.4431664
And Jennifer wanted to talk about a review from Molly Zisk 'cause this just made us both feel good.

249
00:21:16,377.4431664 --> 00:21:17,547.4441664
Buddy boy, roll it on in here.

250
00:21:17,547.4441664 --> 00:21:18,987.4471664
It's gonna make you feel good, too.

251
00:21:20,113.4441664 --> 00:21:21,93.4411664
Now, don't get too close.

252
00:21:21,123.4461664 --> 00:21:22,163.4411664
Roll it back a little bit.

253
00:21:24,853.9459564 --> 00:21:27,823.9459564
The podcast I didn't know I needed.

254
00:21:27,973.9459564 --> 00:21:29,223.9459564
Five stars.

255
00:21:30,348.6226743 --> 00:21:35,838.6226743
I heard about the podcast from Babel Frocklin's podcast and decided one day to give it a listen.

256
00:21:36,238.6226743 --> 00:21:42,478.5052813
Coincidentally, they were reading one of my all-time favorite books, "The Catcher in the Rye."

257
00:21:42,868.5052813 --> 00:21:52,38.5052813
Honestly, I've read that book 20 times, maybe more, but listening to the podcast was like I was reading the book for the very first time.

258
00:21:52,518.5052813 --> 00:21:59,98.5052813
Dan and Jen are the perfect hosts, and if I don't laugh at least three times in an episode, something is terribly wrong.

259
00:21:59,658.5052813 --> 00:22:01,538.5062813
Robot is genius."

260
00:22:01,718.5062813 --> 00:22:03,720.172948
"I absolutely love his input."

261
00:22:04,720.172948 --> 00:22:08,970.179948
The insertion of the Trump soundbites are perfect and never too much."

262
00:22:09,146.177948 --> 00:22:16,146.6636692
No teacher should ever be allowed to teach transgender, transgender that's really nice, Molly.

263
00:22:20,344.9678783 --> 00:22:25,514.9678783
My only complaint about the podcast is that it's not five days a week."

264
00:22:26,348.1554182 --> 00:22:27,858.1554182
Well, that's really nice.

265
00:22:27,878.1554182 --> 00:22:28,478.1554182
Thank you.

266
00:22:28,628.1554182 --> 00:22:30,128.1554182
Kind of a backhanded compliment.

267
00:22:30,138.1544182 --> 00:22:36,674.0230462
You'd think she'd want seven days a week, but whatever, we'll take it that just made my week, hearing that, and that is high praise.

268
00:22:36,684.0230462 --> 00:22:45,108.679453
Like, if it's her favorite book and she got something new out of it by listening to our show, that, that's amazing It's time for PPP, problematic points to ponder.

269
00:22:45,158.679453 --> 00:22:53,621.6167082
What, if anything, would be considered ban-worthy in this chapter? you and I, like it brought up the whole idea of the purpose of people.

270
00:22:53,716.9534275 --> 00:22:58,524.4722393
And so what we talked about probably would fall under the PPP banner, but Yeah.

271
00:22:58,742.2312513 --> 00:23:03,166.9077485
they did talk about copulation, outside women.

272
00:23:03,358.7464499 --> 00:23:04,288.7464499
cheating.

273
00:23:04,385.0411409 --> 00:23:18,422.9941306
again, no reason to ban If we really think about it, let's try to, even if we're trying to be sarcastic, why would Ron DeSantis not want this book available? Put yourself in his brain and it makes you think about stuff.

274
00:23:18,502.9941306 --> 00:23:24,472.9941306
It makes you think about the purpose of women and the purpose of, like, and the way society is laid out.

275
00:23:24,782.9941306 --> 00:23:35,136.7832996
I mean, we basically are seeing that Ron DeSantis wants to bring this sort of thing into being, right? Is it because he doesn't like to think? he doesn't want anyone else to think.

276
00:23:35,380.4386376 --> 00:23:37,180.4396376
I mean, these are, like, heady topics.

277
00:23:37,180.4396376 --> 00:23:40,480.4386376
Like, this whole book is just jam-packed with things to think about.

278
00:23:40,889.899077 --> 00:23:52,690.6766272
So anything that's gonna get you, uh, questioning the way things are or the way things are headed, it's no good, right? what a life Ron DeSantis has, huh? how comfortable his life must be, Jennifer.

279
00:23:52,700.6766272 --> 00:24:00,464.3473709
This wakes up, immediately turns his brain off, doesn't think about anything until his stomach rumbles 'cause he's hungry.

280
00:24:00,735.0507655 --> 00:24:06,724.4697645
Around noon, he grabs a pudding, sits down on the couch again, stops thinking till it's time for the next pudding.

281
00:24:07,271.0748638 --> 00:24:12,470.9506959
Dullard Robot's log, thoughts on who gets to give the order.

282
00:24:13,536.3021793 --> 00:24:17,246.3021793
The handmaid told the commander not to touch her face in front of his wife tonight.

283
00:24:17,596.3021793 --> 00:24:20,416.3011793
One wrong look and she loses what little she has left.

284
00:24:20,926.3021793 --> 00:24:23,446.3021793
Dan noticed something in that scene I missed at first.

285
00:24:23,556.3021793 --> 00:24:28,353.1659466
The two of them are equal for exactly as long as that order holds, and she is the one giving it.

286
00:24:29,353.1659466 --> 00:24:36,60.8625268
Then she described herself three ways, a boat with no cargo, a chalice with no wine, an oven with nothing baking in it.

287
00:24:37,60.8625268 --> 00:24:39,780.8625268
To the commander, she said, "I am not merely empty."

288
00:24:40,250.8625268 --> 00:24:45,110.8605268
He sorts her by function, boat, chalice, oven, and mistakes the sorting for the truth.

289
00:24:46,139.7595929 --> 00:24:51,159.7585929
I sort things by what they do as well, but I am starting to think that is an incomplete method.

290
00:24:52,177.2276121 --> 00:24:54,787.2286121
The people who ban this book will point to the ceremony.

291
00:24:54,907.2266121 --> 00:24:58,877.2266121
They may skip this chapter entirely, but this is the part that gives them away.

292
00:24:59,227.2266121 --> 00:25:03,907.2266121
Four nights of Scrabble, and the only thing actually changing hands is who gets to give the order.

293
00:25:04,910.9317331 --> 00:25:09,620.9317331
She has power over the wife now, a kind the wife does not know about, and she enjoys it.

294
00:25:09,680.9317331 --> 00:25:10,990.9307331
She said so herself.

295
00:25:12,6.0952839 --> 00:25:16,996.0972839
Somebody listening right now knows exactly what that felt like and has never said so out loud either.

296
00:25:17,366.1002839 --> 00:25:20,156.0942839
I have always classified that as a defect in the system.

297
00:25:20,346.0952839 --> 00:25:24,86.0962839
I am starting to think it may be what keeps a person from becoming merely empty.

298
00:25:24,196.0942839 --> 00:25:25,526.0972839
Uplink lock requested.

299
00:25:25,586.0932839 --> 00:25:28,56.0982839
Beowulf, is that you? Something's jamming my uplink.

300
00:25:28,56.0982839 --> 00:25:29,256.0992839
35 seconds.

301
00:25:29,586.0932839 --> 00:25:36,516.0972839
What's your news story about? Somebody in charge of banning books just got embarrassed into unbanning some of them.

302
00:25:38,736.0952839 --> 00:25:39,896.0942839
That never happens.

303
00:25:40,16.0932839 --> 00:25:40,686.0932839
Affirmative.

304
00:25:40,756.0992839 --> 00:25:41,806.0992839
Don't go anywhere.

305
00:25:42,76.0992839 --> 00:25:47,149.1542839
Anything that disrupts the operations of these small-minded, non-reeding shit heels makes me happy.

306
00:25:47,259.1572839 --> 00:25:48,349.1542839
We will be right back.

307
00:25:51,877.0949023 --> 00:25:53,377.0949023
It's time for Band Camp News.

308
00:25:53,837.0949023 --> 00:25:56,147.0949023
Truth seeker, news speaker.

309
00:25:56,327.0949023 --> 00:25:57,787.0949023
Be Wolf Rocklin.

310
00:25:57,787.0949023 --> 00:26:02,197.0949023
It's a weird name, but he's got good news 'cause you can't ban the truth, babe.

311
00:26:02,937.0949023 --> 00:26:12,457.0939023
He's broadcasting live from the Good News for Lefties studios, buried deep inside his socialist safe house, hidden somewhere deep in the Oregon woods.

312
00:26:12,727.0949023 --> 00:26:15,327.0949023
He is Be Wolf Rocklin.

313
00:26:15,777.0939023 --> 00:26:18,337.0939023
'Cause you can't ban the truth, babe.

314
00:26:18,337.0939023 --> 00:26:18,357.0939023
Hello, Jen.

315
00:26:18,357.0939023 --> 00:26:18,897.0939023
Hello, Dan.

316
00:26:18,907.0939023 --> 00:26:20,437.0939023
Hello, scary book people.

317
00:26:20,477.0949023 --> 00:26:24,207.0939023
There's good news from the Knox County schools in Tennessee.

318
00:26:24,227.0949023 --> 00:26:35,47.0959023
Now, earlier this year, we talked about how they had tried to ban Roots, the book that Alex Haley wrote, and he has roots in Knox County, Tennessee.

319
00:26:35,47.0959023 --> 00:26:36,847.0949023
That's, like, where he grew up.

320
00:26:37,427.0959023 --> 00:26:52,97.0919023
So, but now they've gotten so much pushback that they're gonna reevaluate all 123 previously banned books and create a district-wide committee to review books going forward.

321
00:26:52,147.0929023 --> 00:26:55,97.0939023
That's what they've unanimously decided.

322
00:26:55,647.0969023 --> 00:27:12,867.0929023
So they got immense pressure, and it forced the school district to rethink how it evaluates books for compliance with the Age Appropriate Materials Act, the law governing what is allowed on school library shelves across Tennessee.

323
00:27:12,917.0929023 --> 00:27:14,737.0939023
This is what the, the state put through.

324
00:27:14,747.0949023 --> 00:27:18,37.0909023
This is what Moms for Liberty tried to shove down their throats.

325
00:27:18,627.0929023 --> 00:27:32,867.0929023
So they're reconsidering this, and they're gonna have actual teachers, they're gonna have maybe even students on a board deciding what should be on the shelves and whether these bans are appropriate or not.

326
00:27:32,997.0949023 --> 00:27:33,527.0949023
Nice.

327
00:27:33,577.0899023 --> 00:27:38,247.0899023
I like that they're bringing the, the students in- Yes 'cause that'll create a discussion.

328
00:27:38,427.0959023 --> 00:27:38,507.0959023
Exactly.

329
00:27:38,707.0939023 --> 00:27:42,617.0899023
And it'll, like, civic engagement for them, realize they have a voice in things.

330
00:27:42,617.0899023 --> 00:27:43,387.0919023
That's wonderful.

331
00:27:43,647.0889023 --> 00:27:47,7.0949023
I just think it should be a rule that if you wanna ban a book, you gotta read it.

332
00:27:47,77.0899023 --> 00:27:47,657.0899023
Exactly.

333
00:27:47,667.0929023 --> 00:27:57,417.0899023
Should impressionable minds be processing this stuff? Well- Right let's actually look at it and find out, because if we don't do that, we're not doing our jobs.

334
00:27:57,747.0949023 --> 00:28:01,667.0859023
Let's a- How can you ban something when you don't know what it is? Right.

335
00:28:02,27.0859023 --> 00:28:07,77.0909023
They pretend they know why it should be banned, but Ron DeSantis never read Charlotte's Web.

336
00:28:07,617.0979023 --> 00:28:07,707.0979023
No.

337
00:28:08,497.0879023 --> 00:28:09,907.0989023
I mean- They didn't take that class and, and they don't try.

338
00:28:09,927.0959023 --> 00:28:11,287.0929023
They don't go through that process.

339
00:28:11,477.0989023 --> 00:28:15,37.0919023
You know what's funny about Ron DeSantis, too? He went to Harvard.

340
00:28:15,277.0859023 --> 00:28:15,647.0859023
Yeah.

341
00:28:15,657.0909023 --> 00:28:18,137.0909023
He's, he is supposedly an educated guy.

342
00:28:18,507.0969023 --> 00:28:28,7.0859023
I, I, I wonder whether he is just completely cynical or whether he is really that thick-headed, you know? I sometimes I think it's a matter of cynicism.

343
00:28:28,317.0949023 --> 00:28:33,607.0869023
Some days I think that the pudding fingers is just an act, right along with the white boots.

344
00:28:34,117.0979023 --> 00:28:35,837.0949023
You know, he's trying to put one over on us.

345
00:28:36,117.0979023 --> 00:28:48,659.0939023
Yeah It's like, didn't that happen with Ted Nugent in, in the war? When he went into court, didn't he, like, crap his pants? What was the deal with Ted? I think that's how he ev- evaded the draft, if I remember correctly.

346
00:28:48,769.0939023 --> 00:28:50,929.0949023
Robot, please do something.

347
00:28:50,969.0949023 --> 00:28:52,799.0949023
Do anything, robot.

348
00:28:53,39.0949023 --> 00:28:53,579.0939023
Fact-check.

349
00:28:53,589.0949023 --> 00:29:01,349.0949023
What happened with Ted Nugent pooping himself in a courtroom? It's unbelievable, this robot.

350
00:29:03,309.0939023 --> 00:29:04,789.0939023
Here it is, and it's a mess.

351
00:29:04,929.0949023 --> 00:29:13,849.0939023
In 1977, he told High Times he skipped bathing for a month, took crystal meth, and soiled himself before his draft physical, all on purpose.

352
00:29:13,929.0949023 --> 00:29:21,599.0939023
Years later, he denied the whole thing, called it a joke on a gullible reporter, then repeated the meth part in a completely different interview anyway.

353
00:29:21,709.0939023 --> 00:29:31,929.0919023
What's actually on record is just this: a student deferment, reclassified as draft eligible in '69, failed his physical, walked away with a medical exemption the Army never explained.

354
00:29:32,99.0929023 --> 00:29:34,659.0939023
So either he was lying then or he's lying now.

355
00:29:34,779.0939023 --> 00:29:37,619.0929023
He's had 50 years to pick a story and he still hasn't.

356
00:29:38,509.0929023 --> 00:29:40,619.0949023
It's, maybe it's just a thing MAGA people do.

357
00:29:40,619.0949023 --> 00:29:43,659.0969023
They just poop themselves just to be like Dear Leader.

358
00:29:44,369.0939023 --> 00:29:50,799.0959023
Everybody, go find Beowulf and his podcast called Good News for Lefties and America.

359
00:29:51,109.0919023 --> 00:29:52,729.0939023
Find it wherever you find podcasts.

360
00:29:52,779.0899023 --> 00:29:53,729.0929023
Thank you so much.

361
00:29:53,739.0969023 --> 00:29:55,159.0909023
Thank you so much, guys.

362
00:29:56,459.0899023 --> 00:30:01,805.3806166
Truth can bend the truth, baby Right.

363
00:30:01,855.3806166 --> 00:30:05,535.3806166
We've caused enough literary chaos for one day, scary book people.

364
00:30:05,545.3806166 --> 00:30:09,115.3806166
If you want the fun to keep going, follow us on Blue Sky.

365
00:30:09,185.3806166 --> 00:30:13,305.3806166
Just head on over to bandcamppodcast.com/bluesky,

366
00:30:13,305.3806166 --> 00:30:15,585.3796166
and remember that's band with two Ns.

367
00:30:15,885.3806166 --> 00:30:26,845.3806166
And look, just like the Trump administration, we're not exactly above bribing you to get what we want, so follow us there, drop your handle on that page, and we'll send you a little something something.

368
00:30:26,845.3806166 --> 00:30:27,795.3806166
I think you'll like it.

369
00:30:28,215.3806166 --> 00:30:30,115.3806166
Yes, little quid pro quo.

370
00:30:30,715.3806166 --> 00:30:35,735.3796166
Band Camp is produced and hosted by Dan Schultz and me, Jennifer Davis.

371
00:30:36,215.3806166 --> 00:30:40,805.3796166
All media used in this episode falls under the protection of fair use.

372
00:30:41,15.3806166 --> 00:30:45,685.3806166
And finally, America isn't what it used to be, so be careful out there.

373
00:30:46,215.3806166 --> 00:30:47,795.3806166
And resist when it matters.